Home of The Green Arrow

Wednesday, 12 December 2007

Why talk is better than war

“It is a good thing war is so terrible; else we should grow too fond of it.”

War is sweet to those who haven't tasted it.

44 comments:

Anonymous said...: If Griffin keeps piling up the pro Mark Collett propaganda on his sites and blogs then there will be no way back.

Is Griffin building his own funeral stack?
Why has he not listend to what the members want?
Has he gone insane?; 12 December 2007 at 12:21
Anonymous said...: How many members is that then?
Looks like people should shut up or join the Liebour party.; 12 December 2007 at 14:09
Anonymous said...: how many is that you ask,

LISTEN YOU ARROGANT LITTLE TWAT

well out of the 25 or so i have spoken to at least 25 want something done about the issues that have been raised.

1. the constant sacking of people who can no longer put up with collett an Co who has had more than one final warning.

2. the South Africans who are state infiltraing the party that is supposed to be British.

3. trespass and the removing of peoples property and information and displaying said private information on the web. that could lead to Griffin going to court.

4. the incompetence of hannan, Collett etc people which has cost the party money, trust and credibility and power.

most are disgusted with the manner Nick Griffin has handled it.
and all griffin has to say is everything should be on his terms
when the party no longer supports his terms.

he has become paranoid and Stalin like and is self destructing.

i hope he turns it around but right now the party is disgusted with the whole affair.

get a grip on reality Griffin!; 12 December 2007 at 14:36
Anonymous said...: Griffin we loved you but you have bulls up big time and for what? Collett Hannan and paranoia!; 12 December 2007 at 14:42
Anonymous said...: the party want collett out

http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?p=4902159#post4902159

this is stormfront so all of the reds and antis will be voting to keep Collette in yet the vote still shows that a massive majority want him gone - you getting this Griffin!; 12 December 2007 at 14:47
Anonymous said...: SirHM: Get up there boy!; 12 December 2007 at 16:25
Anonymous said...: Green Arrow is an anonymous nark.

Shit stirrer.; 12 December 2007 at 17:02
Anonymous said...: Sadly Mr Darby had to truncate his blog contribution as:

"I have to iron a shirt as I am addressing a pensioner's group a little later."

Shame.; 12 December 2007 at 17:13
Anonymous said...: The evidence suggests that there was a plot to discredit certain individuals and run propaganda critical of the BNP on a public blog with false attribution. Given that the people involved were paid officials is it really a shock that when discovered they were sacked?; 12 December 2007 at 17:18
Anonymous said...: I don't care who hates me. I own Nick and always will. End of.; 12 December 2007 at 17:53
Anonymous said...: As part of a loyal and successful BNP council group I am disturbed to see how Tony Lecomber has suddenly been set loose by Nick.

We remain loyal to the main party but concerned at these events.

Barking & Dagenham Councillors; 12 December 2007 at 18:28
Anonymous said...: "As part of a loyal and successful BNP council group I am disturbed to see how Tony Lecomber has suddenly been set loose by Nick."

Please raise your concerns with the appropriate body.; 12 December 2007 at 19:10
Anonymous said...: "As part of a loyal and successful BNP council group I am disturbed to see how Tony Lecomber has suddenly been set loose by Nick."

And how some were gullible enough to push his bullshit on their blogs.

You listening GA?; 12 December 2007 at 19:15
Anonymous said...: Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

ickle baby.

Much like the twat Collett; 12 December 2007 at 19:38
No Platform said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12 December 2007 at 20:50
Anonymous said...: trespass and the removing of peoples property and information and displaying said private information on the web. that could lead to Griffin going to court.

Lol! In the light of recent bed hopping by yourself and realbnp with your friends at UAF (bin bags?) this was a smart move by Griffin. "Dave" on another thread has suggested members not loyal to your takeover bid may have found their details and whereabouts sold or traded to Ketlan and the girls.
The "property" your referring to I assume was the BNP computer on loan to the activist by the party?

Sensible to take it out of harms way considering your new allies.; 12 December 2007 at 21:02
Anonymous said...: So far we've had a bomber and now a guy who takes it up the back door for "art".

Tremendous.; 12 December 2007 at 21:26
Anonymous said...: Barnbrook, I thought you had more sense than that.; 12 December 2007 at 21:28
Anonymous said...: what's wrong Barnbrook, are you concerned they might be bugging your computer?; 12 December 2007 at 21:28
Anonymous said...: Anonymous said...
If Griffin keeps piling up the pro Mark Collett propaganda on his sites and blogs then there will be no way back.

Is Griffin building his own funeral stack?
Why has he not listend to what the members want?
Has he gone insane?

12 December 2007 12:21

Would you want any of that lot back?; 12 December 2007 at 21:41
Anonymous said...: Supportive Blogs
Lancaster & Morecombe BNP
North East Scotland Nationalists
Thoughts of a young Nationalist
Time To Go

Not the biggest list of supportive blogs I've seen (from EIE)
though they are pretty vitreolic.; 12 December 2007 at 21:53
Anonymous said...: OK Anon, here I am.

The North West region is holding a meeting of fundholders and organisers as I type (I'm not there as I have no car to get there). I'm only telling you that as it's already been publicly released - I've known since Monday that it was coming, but haven't said anything. Security. I'm sure you understand.

My organiser is there and, my having spoken to him on the phone a couple of hours ago, he knows exactly what I think, and will speak for me as well as for himself (I can't yell you what he thinks - it's up to him to do that, if he should want to).

What do I think?

Well, I've been scouring as many blogs as I can since Sunday, and reading hundreds of comments from both nationalists and the opposition (hold your friends close ... etc). I have not found one comment saying good things about Mark Collett. Not one. The nearest to it that I can find is the occasional comment that he's a good web designer. If that's all he's got in his favour then he should be toast, because good web designers are ten a penny.

I've seen MC speaking, and he's not exactly inspiring - maybe to the National Front tendency? but I wouldn't know about that as I do not share that inclination. I've seen film of him saying some outrageously stupid things ON CAMERA! Jesus H Christ how idiotic can you get. And he's not exactly the brightest campfire on the prairie is he - can't be to say and do the things he says and does on camera and in front of journalists who'll leap at any opportunity to rubbish the BNP. Think such thoughts in private - fine. Voice them in private to trusted friends - fine. But not in public. And if you mean some of that kind of stuff, then you shouldn't be in a leadership position in any party. Also, I'm someone who believes that a little bit of personal humility is good for any man (or woman, Louise), and improves him no end. From what I've seen of MC, he doesn't possess an ounce of humility ... He is the stereotype that the opposition tar us all as. Am I qualified to judge such things? I went to university a quarter-century ago, when universities were universities, and I went to two good ones (Wales Bangor and Birmingham Edgbaston). I studied psychology (real psychology, not that Freud etc shite) and have qualifications to postgrad level. So you decide if I'm qualified to judge)

Dave Hannam. I know what's said about him. As a fundholder I deal with Dave Hannam, and have spoken with him both on the phone and face to face, and I've personally found him to be ok. So the balances are occasionally out, a tenner here or there. Well, ok, no one's perfect, and though his efficiency has been criticised, I haven't had cause to share that criticism (I'm not exactly the most efficient of people my own self - and I'm not exactly a forensic accountant in my own right). I have to speak as I find.

Sadie Graham. I've never met, spoken to or listened to Sadie Graham. However, apart from the partisans in this dispute, as I can find no one with anything good to say about MC, so I can find no one to say anything bad about SG. Indeed, to the contrary. And even the partisans who criticise her do not criticise her abilities or her dedication to nationalism. Sadie, the best I can tell, is sound as a pre-Wilson pound.

Kenny Smith. I speak with KS a couple of times every month. I find him effective, efficient, a dedicated nationalist. Apart from the partisans, as for SG, I can find no one who has anything bad to say about him - and myself have nothing for him but praise. Dedicated nationalist, loyal to the BNP and to Nick Griffin, and sound as that same pre-Wilson pound.

Nick Griffin. Nick Griffin is by far the best possible leader the BNP could have, or possibly ever will have. No one inside or outside the party can hold a candle to him in debate. This is why, I believe, the BBC simply will not have him on Question Time. It is why no other political leader will engage with him in public debate. The "No Platform" stance is just something they hide behind. As far as I'm concerned this party is going nowhere without him as leader (but it wont be going anywhere without efficient honest middle-management either, note). However, Nick Griffin has a weakness as a political leader, and it's the same weakness that President Nixon had. Nixon was brought down not through any primary wrongdoing of his own - he was brought down because he had too much loyalty to those close to him. Nick Griffin has too much loyalty to those close to him. He's a politician, for God's sake - that means he should have no qualms about sacrificing those close to him for the good of the party. And remember what we all believe - we believe the good of this party is synonymous with the good of our people and our country. And what is happening right now is not benefitting the party - it's destroying it. If it's not sorted out soon the party really will split ... and that'll be another 30 years in the wilderness. Our country doesn't have another 30 years.

What do I think should be done? Mark Collett should spend a few years as a footsoldier; out there delivering leaflets, meeting and speaking with the public, attending meetings as an ordinary party member. Perhaps he will learn what can and can't be said publicly; what the British people will and wont vote for; and hopefully will develop a little personal humility. He's young, he has time, he'll be able to rise again in the party if he has the political ability.

Nick Griffin should give himself a slap on the wrist for taking this so public on the main party website. Who had ever heard of 'Enough is Enough"? Certainly not me. The opposition didn't have a clue about all this until then. That was a mistake that shouldn't be repeated.

Another mistake that should never be repeated was getting into someone's home by deception, removing property, some of it private and not party property. Also violating the Data Protection Act by publishing private emails. These are things that could result in the police getting involved whether we like it or not. Does anyone suppose the police will be as indulgent with us as they have been (and probably will be again over this latest lot of corruption) with the Labour Party? They, and the media vultures could make us look like a bunch of Nazis. Mistakes mistakes mistakes and misjudgements

SG and KS should face a disciplinary tribunal for taking this public with their weblog. We all know they tried and tried and tried to get this resolved internally, and got precisely nowhere with it. But they still shouldn't have done that. Or if they had done, they should have been open and up front about it. "Here we are, this is who we are, here's what we want to tell you, here's what we want you to tell the leadership". That would have been better.

All other resignations and expilsions should be withdrawn and everyone get on with their jobs. No seeking revenge by anyone.

Then they should be given a slap on the wrist, a black mark in their files, then reinstated into the positions and jobs they do so well. Two years' good behaviour - remove the black mark and allow them to progress as far up in the party as their abilities will take them (which I think will be very far)

So that is what I think. What line am I going to take?

The North West regional meeting should be over by now. The region will have decided its line. My group organiser will have decided his line. I will loyally take my group organiser's line. It's called discipline. I've had a military-type mentality all my life - it's what comes from enlisting at 15 I suppose). I view him as my C.O. - the Colonel, if you like. I see myself as his Warrant Officer, or R.S.M. if you like (an enlisted man's rank). I trust his judgement. I'll know tomorrow what line I'm taking, and it will be whatever line he's taking, even if it's contrary to what I think as said above.

No, that's not a cop-out. G.A. will understand.

Hope I haven't made a fool of myself, or cooked my goose within the party. We can come out of this stronger than we went in.; 12 December 2007 at 23:00
The Green Arrow said...: Sir HM,

A very good summing up of the whole rotten mess.

Today I went to a funeral of a friend and then had to go to the hospital.

Since my return I have duplicated your day and read and read and read and am deeply concerned.

Putting aside the obvious work of trolls and people actively trying to widen the gap between the factions. A lot of people making a stand against MC have made some good points.

In the interests of the Party he should do the decent thing.

I understand your sentiments exactly and wish I could wave a magic wand and turn back time.

Whether our Chairman thought this would blow over in a few days I do not know. But now is the time to demonstrate true leadership and do what is right.

I doubt if this blog will be back to normal for awhile. I have no heart to write or attack a frog let alone the enemy.; 12 December 2007 at 23:18
Anonymous said...: So those of you who joined together with the purpose of thwarting the will of Allah (swt) to bring Britain into submission to Islam have been cast into disunity, recrimination and chaos, and will never rise again.

Islam, with Allah's (swt) help has overthrown better organised and more determined opponents than you Britons could ever produce out of your degenerate drink-sodden and sexually obsessed society.

Ishaq:587 "Our onslaught will not be a weak faltering affair. We shall fight as long as we live. We will fight until you turn to Islam, humbly seeking refuge. We will fight not caring whom we meet. We will fight whether we destroy ancient holdings or newly gotten gains. We have mutilated every opponent. We have driven them violently before us at the command of Allah (swt) and Islam. We will fight until our religion is established. And we will plunder them, for they must suffer disgrace."

Fighting, Allah (swt) willing, may not even be necessary. With the BNP out of the way the conversion of Britain will be mostly peaceful

Britons - prepare to embrace Islam when the time comes, otherwise you and your children will know disgrace.

- Baligha; 12 December 2007 at 23:45
Anonymous said...: Baigha

You will regret it. The British don't lose wars - and war it will be.

Ask anyone else in Europe. We just haven't taken our gloves off yet, with Islam, that's all. When we do take our gloves off, Islam will be ended - not just here, but everywhere.

OK - we lost the American war of independence, but that was British against British.; 12 December 2007 at 23:54
Anonymous said...: Aberdeen Patriot said...
To the anon posters the UAF are not the enemy yes they are a pain in the arse, they are pathetic, the real enemy are the ones who hold the party back i.e messers Collet, Hannam, and Walker. Our war is winning votes and I am sure we will get a lot more once these three have gone.

I dont give a shit what the Uaf say or write they are scumbags who would never be on the front line.

We want to make sure that our troops are worthy of wearing the cap badge. Collet Hannam and Walker would have been weeded out at basic training and dumped.

Is this the new policy? UAF are no longer the enemy just other Nationalists we dont like?
Courtesy EIE and UAF sites, which link. Discreet big arse that guy eh?; 13 December 2007 at 00:07
Anonymous said...: Britons - prepare to embrace Islam when the time comes, otherwise you and your children will know disgrace.

- Baligha

Do shut up son. Our eye has been off the ball the last couple of days but no ones been stoned or decapitated. This is a grown up discussion. Toddle off.; 13 December 2007 at 00:11
Anonymous said...: Grubby little business I've seen and read enough. I'm sticking with Griffin. Anyone who can actually win will always be hated by also rans.
My main concern is that we can no longer trust each other. I dont much care to be in any group that those who joined the rebellion are in. Fortunately their names are out there. We will get back to normal because the public want us.Just watch yourselves out there. Keep your own council and remember walls have ears.

Cheers; 13 December 2007 at 00:24
Anonymous said...: Cheers,
good advice. I was caught up in the family feel of the party and a bit green. I'm gutted I gave so much personal info away to people who are really strangers. I wont say who but i met a couple of the EIE mob and I'll just be voting now. My activist days are over.; 13 December 2007 at 00:40
Anonymous said...: sir HM

I agree with your every point,

this goes beyond Sadie and Co, it goes deeper and further back.

Nick has purged the party of too many good people, why?

because he has become irrational, paranoid. he won his leadership battle to take out the founder of the BNP and this now haunts him -that the same will happen to him.

so he surrounds himself with sycophants and starts to expell anyone who is capable and popular.

then two of the best BNP people say - enough is enough.
Nick we love you but you are destroying the pary.
it is a cry for help not a cry for destruction.

NIck i hope you take on board the members wishes and except some of the blame.

we dont want to lose you Nick, you are an outstanding talent. but should you continue with your Stalin methods then you can go.
we didnt think we would find anyone as good as Tyndal, but we did.

if you want power you need popularity, you wont get that with Stalin methods but you will through listening to the party members.

its time to listen Nick, it really is.; 13 December 2007 at 01:09
Anonymous said...: I think the damage is beyond repair.; 13 December 2007 at 01:12
Anonymous said...: then two of the best BNP people say - enough is enough.
Nick we love you but you are destroying the pary.
it is a cry for help not a cry for destruction.

I think you're kind of over egging their talents here. Sadie granted could have been a star, but KS?

You conned the people who voted for you. They wont forgive that in the housing schemes. If half what you now say is true you covered up filth sleaze and insanity.
Then proved how unfiot you are by the way you tried to fix it.; 13 December 2007 at 01:21
Anonymous said...: Lets get this straight I loved the BNP. I swallwed the message and I gave a lot of donations. I got stick off everyone but I stood firm.
I dont pretend to be a loss to the party. I'm one guy, one lost supporter. I still believe in the cause and I still believe Griffins the guy.
I part company not because a guy like Collett wont get booted out. (He probably would have ) but because guys like you and the plotters planned this half arsed failure of a coup. Done properly Collett would have had no leg to stand on. All you've done is damage the first successful Nationalist movement. We know Griffins tough, loyal, dedicated and a bit authoritarian.
What we now know about the rabble around him is not nearly so attractive.; 13 December 2007 at 01:28
Anonymous said...: Chris Hill appears to have returned to the fold.
The man is unwilling to damage the party and has removed all offensive and disloyal posts.
I applaud him unreservedly.; 13 December 2007 at 02:26
Anonymous said...: Cruddas has apparently called for a police investigation.

time Nick stopped huffing and puffing and saved his own ass along with the party.

get out the humble pie and a big spoon. unless you would rather have handcuffs? Nick?; 13 December 2007 at 02:35
Anonymous said...: if its cruddas thats running it thats okay then, make him a donation to labour cans of worms once opened should be emptied out.
That was why the fab 3 laid the trail of breadcrumbs out for the reds to follow.
The good old smear tactics are the best.; 13 December 2007 at 07:32
Anonymous said...: New names for the party are being suggested on realbnp. BDP The British Democratic Party seems popular.
Sadie Graham suggested as new "chair" on account of being a woman and polishing up image to get away from old Nationalist image.
It WAS all about Collett? Right GA?; 13 December 2007 at 09:19
Anonymous said...: There are no scots organisers left. BNP finished in Scotland.; 13 December 2007 at 09:37
Anonymous said...: New party is a nonsense. The best solution is the resignation of Messrs. Collet and Hannam now.

Even Cruddas the Homeless knows that this is not about the end or division of the BNP so he is trying to cause the damage with call for police investigation. I think that step with Sadie's computer has been highly unfortunate.; 13 December 2007 at 09:47
Anonymous said...: Latest from that Poll

Collet should, with respect to the BNP

leave on his own accord 12 23.08%
be kicked out 32 61.54%
stay in party 8 15.38%

I think however the post of "joefrombradford" sums it up.

It appears that the 8 voting for him to stay in the BNP are those from other parties looking to avoid having him in theirs.

What more needs to be said said about MC's level of liability, when the only people who want him to stay put are the opposition?

The other noticeable thing is that reports of DH's sexually deviant past are being reported to a wider and wider audience, a fact that is increasingly damaging the credibility of everyone associated with the party.

It appears that prior to his taking of under age girls back to his hotel room there are at least TWO other counts now of aggressive sexual behavior towards minors, as well as his notorious porn spamming to other people.

I urge everyone to think very carefully about that, and the implications.

I would think it's obvious to everyone why the media hasn't been running with this, which has been a minor blessing, and that's because they'd prefer to sit and collect the juicy gossip and use it at a more opportune later date, for example during elections.

There can be no solution that allows activities, as highlighted above, to be used against the party at such critical times as those elections.

Can any of us truly endorse perverted behavior, and then get back to work, knowing that we're going to be tainted by that behavior, and hamstrung in our efforts, come election time?

This can not end until such time as MC and DH are removed completely from the party.

Fortunately for NG some of these new revelations have given him a way out of this mess, he has the ability to save face and to say "in light of the new evidence..." remove the offenders, hold a disciplinary for the EIE, administer a slap on the wrist, and everyone can then get back to work.

I urge everyone with the chairmans ear to guide him down such a path.; 13 December 2007 at 10:06
Anonymous said...: Dont be silly. Its too late for that. Some of our more rabid members have constantly alienated wavering voters by referring to Muslim paedophiles muslim groomers and their prophet as a paedophile. Now thanks to the whistleblowers we learn everyone from Griffin to Sadie Graham and Kenny Smith knew about this in our own party.
You've outed it and there is no going back with griffin at the head.
Graham and Smith have already all but created a new party and the change of name was thrown in the ring on the realbnp blog.
Someone even suggested Sadie as Chair. That would not be a bad thing as it makes us more inclusive. British Asian and British black members should also be welcomed. This is a golden opp for an overhaul of the sleaze that's come out on the internet.
we're all going to look pretty daft in our Union flags after this public spat.
The people I canvassed thought everything was rosey so did I.
I never knew my comrades were protecting paedophiles.
many of us dont want to be tainted by association with anyone who knew about this and covered it up till they decided the time was right to go public. A complete break with our Nazi past is required and now its out its not going back in.
Collett and Griffin should go and Sadie and Kenny should be disciplined for covering up Colletts behaviour from the grassroots members risking life and limb from intimidation from Reds.
That said I support Kenny anmd Sadies immediate reinstatement.
Collett and Griffin out.; 13 December 2007 at 10:25
Anonymous said...: Allow yourselves to be guided by Allah and purge hate and racism from your minds.
Inshallah you will be saved.; 13 December 2007 at 10:53
Anonymous said...: You will find that Nick Griffin has more support than current internet chatter might lead you to believe. Legitimate and constructive criticism is one thing - sabotage and treating with the enemy another. Genuine grievances are being used to undermine the Party before important elections. All Nationalists should now cease comment and blogs should not carry threads. Enough damage has been done.; 13 December 2007 at 12:53
Anonymous said...: GA

The post from anon 12:53 is spot on I think.

The comments are infested with either reds or idiots and it's not doing us any good.

Please turn mod on or disable coments until this storm is blown out. I know it's not your style and your freedom for commenters on here is a real credit to you but I think the stupid have had their say and it's pouring petrol on the fire.

Just visited Birmingham BNP website and they're requesting the same. Have a clean up, get rid of the nonsense or even threads containing nonsense and let's not give any more platforms to the stupid.

Also just nipped over to EIE and it has quietened down dramatically with some reconsierding and urging for reconciliation. I get the feeling there is a lot happening now behind the scenes - let the main players thrash this out now.

Enough is enough - indeed.

We'll be here when this blows over GA no doubt of that.

Reconquista.; 13 December 2007 at 14:21